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Printed Circuit Board Assembly & PCB Design Forum

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A.O.I - Design - Brainstorm

#34158

A.O.I - Design - Brainstorm | 9 May, 2005

Hi everyone! Me and my R&D team are working on the design of a highly flexible AOI. I'd like to know your "wishlist" on what you'd like a brand-new AOI to have. I gotta figure out the competitive advantage; what a better place than this "Agora". I'd love to hear comments from guys such as Iman, Dave, Fastek, Swagner, Davef, etc. who have a long record of postings. Sales and end-user comments are welcome. Feel free to contact me if you're interested in participating on a virtual focus group.

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Rob

#34185

A.O.I - Design - Brainstorm | 11 May, 2005

No Shadowing issues No bugs in the software Stable platfrom Free software upgrades Inclusive full part data library Good part editor Easy of programming Ease of maintenance Bar code reader compatable Offline repair station with record of board & fault Offline programming option Very low false call rate Easily accessed & downloaded stats Wide board size range Low cost spares Bomb proof reliability Good support with fast response times

Enough to get you going?

Rob.

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#34188

A.O.I - Design - Brainstorm | 11 May, 2005

As Rob states we want it all. Our companies want it cheap.

Jerry

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Rob

#34189

A.O.I - Design - Brainstorm | 11 May, 2005

Cheers Jerry, forgot the most important one!

Also want it to do:

laser 3D volumetric solderpaste inspection Pre-reflow (including fault logging by placement machine & individual feeder) Post reflow solder joint inspection & handle lead free joints as good as leaded Logo, colour change, symbol & value reading with easy input of alternatives. Varying levels of security & access rights. Also handle multiple component heights from 0201 to huge large can elcos - did I mention I'd like it to do through hole and wavesolder inspection?

Cheers,

Rob.

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#34198

A.O.I - Design - Brainstorm | 11 May, 2005

Rob, - with free software upgrades included, how about hardware upgrades!? no prob paying for those? - "good part editor" do you have one you specially love/hate? - Bar corde reader is already considered, we're thinking on adding a DataMatrix reader, how about that? - How low is "low" (Very low false call rate) give me a percentage please. - We're thinking on embedding a SPC software to manage stats, is this OK or would it be better to just make the data available for the person in charge to evaluate by whichever means he/she likes? - We're aiming at a 22x28cm envelope size, is this enough? or what would be your target? - What do you mean with "Low cost spares" and "Bomb Proof Reliability"? - Good support with fast response times means our "customer support"? - mmm... through hole and wavesolder inspection... headache, let me process that... Thanks guys, hope to hear back from you.

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FD

#34200

A.O.I - Design - Brainstorm | 11 May, 2005

Well, we don't use AOI, but a 22x28CM (8x11 inches) board size seems a bit small. Our pick and place machines are running boards as big as 20x18 inches (51x46CM) and most average in the 16x14 inch range (41x36CM). We are starting to get larger boards from some customers in the area of 24x22 inches (61x56CM). Granted these are telecommunication and networking boards, so not everyone is building them.

An AOI machine with small available board size may be OK for some or most people; just not us. And "no" we are not looking to buy an AOI machine.

And for the free hardware upgrades I haven't heard of this before unless the board installed has a design problem and actually doesn't function as promised or if the machine will malfunction and damage something or hurt someone.

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#34202

A.O.I - Design - Brainstorm | 11 May, 2005

Thanks, Frank. What are your inspection means? Visual? X-RAY? Thanks for the comments! Cheers! DSR

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Rob

#34205

A.O.I - Design - Brainstorm | 12 May, 2005

1) Only if it's a real enhancement, and not to fix a fault in your design. 2) No, it just has to be instinctive & accurate.

3) Barcode is fine by me, but others swear by data matrix

4) Better than 1 in 10,000 - which could be once every 5 boards. We buy these machines from you to cut down on someone checking errors, not to have someone standing there for false calls.

5)I'd rather you just made the data available and concentrated on making the machine software bug free.

6)The board area is too small, you would be reducing your market from CEMs to some OEMs. At least 310mm x 220mm.

7) I don't want to pay $300 for a $20 lightbulb, or $2000 for a $200 servo card that should have been made properly in the first place. I also want it to have safeguards in place to stop operators damaging it - eg. driving the camera stage into the conveyor.

8)It means you answer the phone when something goes wrong & have an intellegent, well informed person available to talk to, & if neccesary come out to fix it ASAP. Also You need to keep spares of everything in stock, at least in the same country, and for the next 10 years.

O yeah, It needs to look good.

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deyo

#34214

A.O.I - Design - Brainstorm | 12 May, 2005

I've looked at a lot of AOI's in the past couple years. First and formost KEEP IT SIMPLE! Second clamp the boards down this will aid in keeping the camera feild of veiw stable, most that I've looked at this was an option not a stock feature. Also side angle cameras that can see all the leads on the largest J-leaded component.Third if you are offering caracter recogntion allow for large amounts of shift in the text placement.For layout try to use gerber data most production personel know this format. as far as the "bells and whistles" ie, the solder paste laser inspection stuff I think that type of stuff should be optional. Again KEEP IT SIMPLE and inexpensive and you should do well.

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#34225

A.O.I - Design - Brainstorm | 12 May, 2005

Thanks Rob, very useful comments. Thanks Deyo, yours too! I truly appreciate every single line on this talk! Cheers!

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