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SMT Equipment

Is it true that some SMT Equipment (e.g. DEK, MPM, Panaser... - Jul 26, 2002 by

GregH

#20895

SMT Equipment "Made in China" | 26 July, 2002

Is it true that some SMT Equipment (e.g. DEK, MPM, Panasert etc.)are now being built in China? Has anyone seen an equipment tagged with "MADE IN CHINA"? Watchout guys....It's in progress!!!

What kind of quality will they have if they are built in China? What about the Reliability of the Equipment?

regards,

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#20897

SMT Equipment | 27 July, 2002

Don't make me laugh. Where did you come up with that?

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#20899

SMT Equipment | 27 July, 2002

Don't laugh, Dek does make printers in China. But not available in the States.

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GregH

#20905

SMT Equipment | 28 July, 2002

I'll be honest with you FASTEK, I personally learned from our local DEK distributor that DEK ELA is currently being built / assembled in China.

regards,

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GregH

#20906

SMT Equipment | 28 July, 2002

again....it might become available in the States as it is currently being sold in Asia Pacific.

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VMS

#20909

SMT Equipment | 28 July, 2002

Well here is one that even I don't want to believe, but mpm will start makeing the up2000's in asia soon. And I got that from mpm.

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#20910

SMT Equipment | 28 July, 2002

Currently, lots of OEM or CM's have moved to China already. Solectron, Flextronic, Motorola, Nokia & Ericsson. Sooner or later, SMT assembly equipment will move their manufacturing plan to China.

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#20911

SMT Equipment | 28 July, 2002

The only reason MPM and DEK would decide to do such a thing is if they have determined that their low end market's future is not in this country but in China. It makes sense if most of those systems end up being sold into that market, why not simply build them there as well. In addition, they could increase market share in China and support them better with a manufacturing presense there. If that's what their motivation is it makes perfect sense. When I first saw your post, I thought you were implying that they had decided to shift all of their production to China. That's why I was laughing.

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Dreamsniper

#20912

SMT Equipment | 28 July, 2002

It is possible that sooner they will build their High End Equipment in China since most of the CM's are moving to China. But what will be the effect on the quality of these equipment and how will that impact their reliability will be a big question. If I'm going to compare goods marked "Made in Taiwan" and "Made in China", I will go with Taiwan made products as their quality has matured. Would you like to have an equipment that breaksdown the moment you press the start button? This is only one of the many challenges that MPM, DEK etc. will be having when moving their production to China....Eventually, China like South Korea will come up with their own Pick and Place Machines.

regards

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#20913

SMT Equipment | 28 July, 2002

Wrong Sai. Quite a difference between assembling a board or a PC and building/assembling a screen printer. These systems being built in China will be for the China or Asian market only. MPM and DEK spent decades trying to establish themselves as the dominant screen printer vendors in this country. They have been a success because they build quality products that last. All of that hard work would be lost in a heartbeat if they ever decided to do what you guys fear they will do. Trust me, they're not that stupid. And do you guys honestly believe that Fuji or Panasonic would allow the Chinese to take control of their production? They'd rather jump off a cliff before they let that happen.

The bottom line to all of this is the OEM's are starving right now but it's not because their costs are out of line. They could reduce the prices by 50% (which I guess they've already tried) and it still won't increase sales. Nobody needs their products right now and if they do, they are finding it used. You can thank the Solectrons, Flextronics and the other big CM's for that! The worst thing this market ever allowed to happen was to let the big CM's buy up everyone in the last two years. Now look what's happening: all the factories that Solectron bought up are being mothballed and many of you guys are looking for jobs. Not only that but Solectron says the hell with this country, we're going to China. Ah....don't get me going!

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#20914

SMT Equipment | 28 July, 2002

Sniper-

What will be the effect on quality? That's a given. How long would they stay in business in this country would be the question.

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#20916

SMT Equipment | 28 July, 2002

Rick, I beleive that many of the OEM's will move their manufaxturing plants closer to the customer. Why wouldn't they? Material costs alone would save them gazillions. Free of almost free land, long term low interest loans in tax free zones, how can they refuse?

When I was in SZ, China earlier this year, we drove by Universal's new building who is planning to build GSM and thru-hole machines later this year.

As far as quality is concerned, much of the Taiwanese high-end notebooks are now built in the Shanghai area. We visited a plant that was assembling Dell, Sony, Compaq and IBM products in a very sophisticated facility. This one plant produced 600,000 motherboards/month for Dell alone.

MM Malcolm

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CAL

#20920

SMT Equipment | 28 July, 2002

From my understanding these China OEM machines are for very specific production with low flexibility. i.e. Smaller board sizes.....machines just for memory modules. With those examples they will beable to reduce conveyor sizes, linear motor sizes which in turn reduce the cost of the machines.

It is highly unlikly these machines will show up on the US market, but....as we all know times have changed and the Machine OEMs need to have machines from the low end user to the high end user. This is just hear-say and none is based on facts

Cal

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#20921

SMT Equipment | 29 July, 2002

Malcolm-

Again, I point out that assembling a notebook is very different than building a sophisticated screen printer.

As far as sourcing parts, I'd bet that nothing in an MPM printer is made in China at the moment. So that means MPM will have to export every single component from the US to China. Guess what, the costs just went through the roof. Or, if you wish they can completely re-design the machine so most if not all of the components can be sourced from China. Motors, bearings, electronics, cameras, plattens etc. When that happens, it'll be an MPM in name only because it won't perform or last like anything made by MPM today. Like I said, if they keep those machines in Asia, that's one thing. If they try to market them here, it'll kill them. I think we all could agree on that fact.

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#20922

SMT Equipment | 29 July, 2002

All DEK 248 semi-auto printers have been built in China for quite some time (years). Its shipped to the UK from China. All DEK ELA models are now built in China (past 6 mos.?). Thats the fact Jack. All MPM models are built in Mass. Its the savings in metal parts that is making China and Asia look so good. Labor cost, as a percentage of total cost on an automatic printer is minor. MPM has cut their cycle time nearly in half in the past year. MPM uses local suppliers for outsourcing.

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#20923

SMT Equipment | 29 July, 2002

Start killing DEK now, on the ELA. All DEK 248 semi-auto printers have been built in China for quite some time (years). Its shipped to the UK from China. All DEK ELA models are now built in China, since 01 some time. Thats the fact Jack. All MPM models are built in Mass.- for now. Its the savings in metal parts that is making China and Asia look so good. Labor cost, as a percentage of total cost on an automatic printer is minor. MPM has cut their cycle time nearly in half in the past year. MPM uses local suppliers for outsourcing some sub-assemblies. Still, too many parts would have to be shipped to China from North America. Then will be subject to 20% duty if the machine ships NA or EU, or anywhere out of the Free Trade Zone. MPM is not building the UP2000 in China. Currently, most UP2000 printers built today go to Asia.

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#20924

SMT Equipment | 29 July, 2002

VMS, Not true. Granted, they are doing a feasability study, but no decision has been made.

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Rob Fischer

#20929

SMT Equipment | 29 July, 2002

How about Kulicke and Soffa? They've been making their wire bonding equipment there for years and have finally decided to do all of their manufacturing there. I think we're all faced with the same concern and it is frustrating because there are very few of us who even have a say in what goes on, let alone where. I feel that most of the large scale production will end up there, equipment manufacturers will gradually end up there, if only to build exclusively for the Asia. A few key personnel expatriated to the area will be in control of quality and it will only be a matter of time before lower end equipment gets re-introduced to the market to compete against the big boys.

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VMS

#20935

SMT Equipment | 29 July, 2002

Hi pete If mpm is thinking about building a machine in china, I would think the up3000 ( or what ever they call it this week) would be a good suggestion.

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#20936

SMT Equipment | 29 July, 2002

Hi VMS, I think if any model it would be the one they sell the most to the Asia market, which is the UltraPrint 2000. By the way, the UP3000 is called the UltraFlex 3000 this week. The UF3K is the top-of-the-range machine, top $$$$.

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CAL

#20949

SMT Equipment | 29 July, 2002

Just a small note...KNS Subcontracted an advanced placement machines and bonder from Datacon (Austria). With KNS moving all of their equipment production over seas Datacon (Also thought it was time to go direct)went direct in the US market.

Datacon was awarded #1 by its customers. Datacon is located in Philadelphia, PA.

www.datacon.at

Best regards, Cal

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Nikita

#21020

SMT Equipment | 1 August, 2002

Who laugh and then who is stupid.

One of the Good Brand name Printer was made in China and we had used over one year. They are very good condition in comapring the previous model.

A US brand name mounter was also made in China.

She will buid it herself in this year

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#21022

SMT Equipment | 1 August, 2002

What US brand mounter is made in China?

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