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SMT electronics assembly manufacturing forum.


Product Segmentation in Pick Place Machines?

Jennifer

#9661

Product Segmentation in Pick Place Machines? | 10 September, 1999

Okay guys (and my fellow lady lurkers), I am trying to determine WHAT the segmentation is for the products in the pick and place industry.

For example, I know in screen/stencil printing, there are manuals, there are semi-automatics, mid- and high-range automatics. In p&p, however, I'm clueless.

I have spoken with Siemens - who gave me one set of segments: high speed, flexible/fine pitch, super high speed and high-speed flip chip. Panasonic, however, thought that was a totally bizarre market segmentation, and suggested medium volume, high volume, multi-functional and fine-pitch and a small segment called "micro electronics."

In a market research study from 1997, I find the following segments - low volume, medium volume, high volume and fine pitch.

What is it REALLY? Is it subjective across different companies? Is there not real industry standard?

Arrrgh!

Jennifer

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Earl Moon

#9662

Re: Product Segmentation in Pick Place Machines? | 10 September, 1999

| Okay guys (and my fellow lady lurkers), I am trying to determine WHAT the segmentation is for the products in the pick and place industry. | | For example, I know in screen/stencil printing, there are manuals, there are semi-automatics, mid- and high-range automatics. In p&p, however, I'm clueless. | | I have spoken with Siemens - who gave me one set of segments: high speed, flexible/fine pitch, super high speed and high-speed flip chip. Panasonic, however, thought that was a totally bizarre market segmentation, and suggested medium volume, high volume, multi-functional and fine-pitch and a small segment called "micro electronics." | | In a market research study from 1997, I find the following segments - low volume, medium volume, high volume and fine pitch. | | What is it REALLY? Is it subjective across different companies? Is there not real industry standard? | | Arrrgh! | | Jennifer | Ain't it a bitch? Not you, please, but couldn't you just go that way?

All answers are correct - until you make the decision concerning what you do to satisfy your customers. I mean, are you doing high mix/low volume, high volume/low mix, or prototyping, or no chip shooting but only fine pitch, and on it goes. After this determination, I know you've already made, you can approach these folks again and reduce semantics to reality.

Most all major players offer something compromising most all requirements. Even Fuji tries to satisfy fine pitch, low volume stuff as does Panasonic and Sanyo. The real cross over artists are Zevatech (whoever they are now), MYDATA, Philips, Universal, Seimens, and others who satisfy mostly those not willing to pay for excessive performance as CPH alone.

Ain't life in the SMT world great?

MoonMan

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JAX

#9663

Re: Product Segmentation in Pick Place Machines? | 10 September, 1999

| | Okay guys (and my fellow lady lurkers), I am trying to determine WHAT the segmentation is for the products in the pick and place industry. | | | | For example, I know in screen/stencil printing, there are manuals, there are semi-automatics, mid- and high-range automatics. In p&p, however, I'm clueless. | | | | I have spoken with Siemens - who gave me one set of segments: high speed, flexible/fine pitch, super high speed and high-speed flip chip. Panasonic, however, thought that was a totally bizarre market segmentation, and suggested medium volume, high volume, multi-functional and fine-pitch and a small segment called "micro electronics." | | | | In a market research study from 1997, I find the following segments - low volume, medium volume, high volume and fine pitch. | | | | What is it REALLY? Is it subjective across different companies? Is there not real industry standard? | | | | Arrrgh! | | | | Jennifer | | | Ain't it a bitch? Not you, please, but couldn't you just go that way? | | All answers are correct - until you make the decision concerning what you do to satisfy your customers. I mean, are you doing high mix/low volume, high volume/low mix, or prototyping, or no chip shooting but only fine pitch, and on it goes. After this determination, I know you've already made, you can approach these folks again and reduce semantics to reality. | | Most all major players offer something compromising most all requirements. Even Fuji tries to satisfy fine pitch, low volume stuff as does Panasonic and Sanyo. The real cross over artists are Zevatech (whoever they are now), MYDATA, Philips, Universal, Seimens, and others who satisfy mostly those not willing to pay for excessive performance as CPH alone. | | Ain't life in the SMT world great? | | MoonMan | Jennifer, The MoonMan nailed it. You have to understand the current stratagy at which your shop runs and the direction you want to take it in the future. You have to understand the budget constraints with which you are working under. These will decide the segmentation you are looking for. Machines come in all shapes and sizes and until you understand where your company stands in the whole game deciding on equipment can only hinder your companies progress.

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Dave G

#9664

Re: Product Segmentation in Pick Place Machines? | 11 September, 1999

| | | Okay guys (and my fellow lady lurkers), I am trying to determine WHAT the segmentation is for the products in the pick and place industry. | | | | | | For example, I know in screen/stencil printing, there are manuals, there are semi-automatics, mid- and high-range automatics. In p&p, however, I'm clueless. | | | | | | I have spoken with Siemens - who gave me one set of segments: high speed, flexible/fine pitch, super high speed and high-speed flip chip. Panasonic, however, thought that was a totally bizarre market segmentation, and suggested medium volume, high volume, multi-functional and fine-pitch and a small segment called "micro electronics." | | | | | | In a market research study from 1997, I find the following segments - low volume, medium volume, high volume and fine pitch. | | | | | | What is it REALLY? Is it subjective across different companies? Is there not real industry standard? | | | | | | Arrrgh! | | | | | | Jennifer | | | | | Ain't it a bitch? Not you, please, but couldn't you just go that way? | | | | All answers are correct - until you make the decision concerning what you do to satisfy your customers. I mean, are you doing high mix/low volume, high volume/low mix, or prototyping, or no chip shooting but only fine pitch, and on it goes. After this determination, I know you've already made, you can approach these folks again and reduce semantics to reality. | | | | Most all major players offer something compromising most all requirements. Even Fuji tries to satisfy fine pitch, low volume stuff as does Panasonic and Sanyo. The real cross over artists are Zevatech (whoever they are now), MYDATA, Philips, Universal, Seimens, and others who satisfy mostly those not willing to pay for excessive performance as CPH alone. | | | | Ain't life in the SMT world great? | | | | MoonMan | | | Jennifer, | The MoonMan nailed it. You have to understand the current stratagy at which your shop runs and the direction you want to take it in the future. You have to understand the budget constraints with which you are working under. These will decide the segmentation you are looking for. Machines come in all shapes and sizes and until you understand where your company stands in the whole game deciding on equipment can only hinder your companies progress. |

To put a different spin on this ...

You could look at it a bit differently.

I work in the high volume market. (>4 Mil Pcb's/yr) My choice was not to go to one vendor for a solution but, to pick (In my Opinion) the best equip to each of the jobs in a SMT line. Hence I have multi-vendor High Volume lines. Back to the ?

Budget constraints and cost per placement are primary drivers. But, Consider Volume,Product mix and unique component #'s as secondary drivers. Do you need to build 1-3 pcbs @ extremely high volumes or, is your operation more suited to multiple PCB jobs running at low volumes. This will help narrow your choices a bit.

High volume shops tend to go for fast & accurate equip (Universal,Philips,Panasonic) Cost/placement = high

Med - Low Volume/Med Mix usually = Panasonic or Fuji They go for some speed but, ease of changeover is a big consideration. This helps to reduce downtime and costs. Cost/Placement = Mid range

Low Volume - High Mix shops = Mydata,Zevatech,Quad Etc. They want extreme flexibility but, speed isn't a major factor. See lots of platform type machines here, not many purpose built dedicated machines like the vol manufacturers use.

Just some thoughts to consider. GSMGURU

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The Guc

#9665

Re: Product Segmentation in Pick Place Machines? | 14 September, 1999

| | | Okay guys (and my fellow lady lurkers), I am trying to determine WHAT the segmentation is for the products in the pick and place industry. | | | | | | For example, I know in screen/stencil printing, there are manuals, there are semi-automatics, mid- and high-range automatics. In p&p, however, I'm clueless. | | | | | | I have spoken with Siemens - who gave me one set of segments: high speed, flexible/fine pitch, super high speed and high-speed flip chip. Panasonic, however, thought that was a totally bizarre market segmentation, and suggested medium volume, high volume, multi-functional and fine-pitch and a small segment called "micro electronics." | | | | | | In a market research study from 1997, I find the following segments - low volume, medium volume, high volume and fine pitch. | | | | | | What is it REALLY? Is it subjective across different companies? Is there not real industry standard? | | | | | | Arrrgh! | | | | | | Jennifer | | | | | Ain't it a bitch? Not you, please, but couldn't you just go that way? | | | | All answers are correct - until you make the decision concerning what you do to satisfy your customers. I mean, are you doing high mix/low volume, high volume/low mix, or prototyping, or no chip shooting but only fine pitch, and on it goes. After this determination, I know you've already made, you can approach these folks again and reduce semantics to reality. | | | | Most all major players offer something compromising most all requirements. Even Fuji tries to satisfy fine pitch, low volume stuff as does Panasonic and Sanyo. The real cross over artists are Zevatech (whoever they are now), MYDATA, Philips, Universal, Seimens, and others who satisfy mostly those not willing to pay for excessive performance as CPH alone. | | | | Ain't life in the SMT world great? | | | | MoonMan | | | Jennifer, | The MoonMan nailed it. You have to understand the current stratagy at which your shop runs and the direction you want to take it in the future. You have to understand the budget constraints with which you are working under. These will decide the segmentation you are looking for. Machines come in all shapes and sizes and until you understand where your company stands in the whole game deciding on equipment can only hinder your companies progress. |

reply »

The Guc

#9666

Re: Product Segmentation in Pick Place Machines? | 14 September, 1999

| | | | Okay guys (and my fellow lady lurkers), I am trying to determine WHAT the segmentation is for the products in the pick and place industry. | | | | | | | | For example, I know in screen/stencil printing, there are manuals, there are semi-automatics, mid- and high-range automatics. In p&p, however, I'm clueless. | | | | | | | | I have spoken with Siemens - who gave me one set of segments: high speed, flexible/fine pitch, super high speed and high-speed flip chip. Panasonic, however, thought that was a totally bizarre market segmentation, and suggested medium volume, high volume, multi-functional and fine-pitch and a small segment called "micro electronics." | | | | | | | | In a market research study from 1997, I find the following segments - low volume, medium volume, high volume and fine pitch. | | | | | | | | What is it REALLY? Is it subjective across different companies? Is there not real industry standard? | | | | | | | | Arrrgh! | | | | | | | | Jennifer | | | | | | | Ain't it a bitch? Not you, please, but couldn't you just go that way? | | | | | | All answers are correct - until you make the decision concerning what you do to satisfy your customers. I mean, are you doing high mix/low volume, high volume/low mix, or prototyping, or no chip shooting but only fine pitch, and on it goes. After this determination, I know you've already made, you can approach these folks again and reduce semantics to reality. | | | | | | Most all major players offer something compromising most all requirements. Even Fuji tries to satisfy fine pitch, low volume stuff as does Panasonic and Sanyo. The real cross over artists are Zevatech (whoever they are now), MYDATA, Philips, Universal, Seimens, and others who satisfy mostly those not willing to pay for excessive performance as CPH alone. | | | | | | Ain't life in the SMT world great? | | | | | | MoonMan | | | | | Jennifer, | | The MoonMan nailed it. You have to understand the current stratagy at which your shop runs and the direction you want to take it in the future. You have to understand the budget constraints with which you are working under. These will decide the segmentation you are looking for. Machines come in all shapes and sizes and until you understand where your company stands in the whole game deciding on equipment can only hinder your companies progress. | | | Are you still confused? If so, plaese let me know, I can hopefully supply you with the accurte data. |

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