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Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations?

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John B.

#48615

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 24 March, 2007

We're currently running a manncorp ECM-93, which has served us alright, but we've pretty much outgrown it.

We manufacture power electronics, a lot of double sided designs with odd form parts. We have about 30 different designs we manufacture, and we run maybe 200 of each board a month. Part of the problem with our current machine is its slow, and a lot of the problem is that its not all that repeatable/consistent, so someone has to check the boards with tweezers, and tweak a component here or place a missed component there. That's annoying. Also there are ome components that we just have to place by hand (smaller than .8mm pitch)

We need a new machine (or probably a used machine) with the following capabilities:

0402 discretes .5mm pitch ICs Odd form parts (SMT dip switch blocks, encoders, etc) Batch processing 4000ish places/hour ICs up to 25mm square Relatively inexpensive large tape feeders (16 and 24mm especially) and stick feeders Easy changeover Handles really tiny panels (.75" x 4" or smaller)

It'd be nice if it was a common enough machine that it was easy to find feeders on the used market. That's a major problem with the ECM-93 (its a mamiya machine, feeders are hen's teeth)

I'd prefer to lease or finance for not more than $1500 a month. Suggestions?

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pickNplace

#48625

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 25 March, 2007

Have you looked at Automated Production SYstems? They manufacture here in the US...?

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#48632

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 25 March, 2007

Samsung CP-50 should suit your requirements. All feeders from the Samsung range are compatible except the new SM320/321 series. Don't know about the financial side. I have never used this model but the people I know who have are happy with them. Might be worth a look.

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TC Chua

#48633

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 25 March, 2007

You should look around for a second hand machine, in-expensive, that come with laser on the fly, and vision as well. This capability is quite available in number of models by now.

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#48669

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 27 March, 2007

High mix low volume I would say Mydata would be a good choice, If set up time isn't a big factor I would choose Siemens F4 for reliably, serviceability and OEM support.

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Base

#48672

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 27 March, 2007

used Philips Emerald, Emerald-X or Emerald X2 if you want networking and an easy GUI. The first 2 are DOS-based, the latter one WinNT based. They take the Yamaha feeders, which are frequently offered on the equipment mart.

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#48684

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 27 March, 2007

We replaced a manncorp machine with a MyData about 3 years ago and have been very satisfied. A Mydata machine should meet all of your requirements with the possible excpetion of the odd form parts but I am not sure any machine does those well. The really small panels might be a bit trick as well so you should check on that. MyData has very good customer support.

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John B.

#48687

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 28 March, 2007

Looking at the Emerald machines, they do seem like they'd fit the bill quite nicely. Other than the operating system, is one generation markedly better than the others? I have all the data on the X2 from the manufacturer's site, but what changed from the older ones is an open question. Is it possible to get support for older machines?

The other thing I forgot to mention is we work with a lot of taller SMT electrolytic caps. So anything that can't place at least 12mm tall is right out.

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Base

#48724

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 29 March, 2007

As far as I know you can still get support on the regular and the X-type Emeralds. Apart from the operating system the differences are not that big between those and the X2-type, I think the output and accuracy would be better and maybe there's some additional software and hardware options. I also don't know if it can do 12mm high components and taller. You'd have to dig a little deeper to get that information out. Depending on where you're located it may be worthwhile to contact Philips (Assembleon nowadays) and get the info you need. Asking a question doesn't mean you have to to buy it from them. There's plenty of Emeralds in the US and in Europe so getting support for it should be no issue.

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vasily

#48730

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 29 March, 2007

http://www.fritsch-smt.com/en/indexx.htm

PA 600 - Good repeatability, accuracy, huge amount of feeders, can be upgradable at your facility if you outgrow it also.

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John B.

#48854

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 3 April, 2007

We've got an angle on a 1997 Universal GSM that seems like it might fit the bill (on paper) for what seems like a fair price. Any comments on whether it'd be a good way to go for this application?

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Rob

#48893

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 5 April, 2007

Hi John,

Depending on what cameras it has it will do most of what you want, however it won't do it very fast. Also the operating system may make you cry.

Regarding accuracy, repeatability, oddform etc it is very good.

Good luck,

Rob.

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beentheredonethat

#48900

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 5 April, 2007

Definitely recommend the Siemens F4/5 machine for your application. Based on experience I can say placement accuracy/repeatability is DNO (that�s Dead Nuts On). Good luck.

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PFI

#49070

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 17 April, 2007

i would also take a look at the Juki 2000 series

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bbl

#49347

Need a new Pick/Place. Recommendations? | 26 April, 2007

If you're still looking and cost is a major factor. Celestica Toronto is selling a couple of GSM 1's in reasonable condition. They should do the job and there's tons of parts/feeders etc available in the used market. I think they're asking around $25k. When new, these suckers went for over $350k - plus feeders. New Universal Advantis for about $160k plus feeders is a decent machine too.

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