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new OMRON VT-RNS-pt

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#66017

new OMRON VT-RNS-pt PCB Inspection | 19 March, 2012

have anyone experience in this AOI ?Im going to buy a AOI and im interested to know about this new PCB Inspection

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#66027

new OMRON VT-RNS-pt PCB Inspection | 20 March, 2012

Based on my experience with OMRON VT-RNS, I would not consider this machine unless you are running high volumes of a limited number of assemblies. Programming and debug took a lot more time than than other machines in the same price range. After debugging the programs the machine ran well enough, just a lot of time spent "cleaning up" the inspection program after the auto programming.
Look at Mirtec, Yestech, and MVP too.

I have no affiliation with any company listed above.
`hege

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#66043

new OMRON VT-RNS-pt PCB Inspection | 21 March, 2012

I agree with Heg,and can say that I went through this process last year and ended up getting a Yestech FX series with an 8 micron camera. I haven't had any issues that they were unable to assist me with via email. There's a big market for AOI equipment, and I imagine it is going to get bigger as parts become increasingly difficult to inspect/verify by the human eye.

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#66068

new OMRON VT-RNS-pt PCB Inspection | 26 March, 2012

Hello Sergio,
I can provide you expert perspective on the VT-RNS-PT from Omron as well as on the YESTech platforms.
The VT-RNS-PT product is super complicated and difficult to understand from a programming and operation standpoint and really does not provide any inspection benefits that the YESTech or other systems provide. The programming and operation interface are much more complex and not as intuitive as other systems are and the position in the market shows it. The VT-RNS-PT is also not very well supported here in the US from a training or software standpoint. Omron has a couple of AE’s that are top notch AE’s but the product is the limiting factor. Additionally, both the training and any software updates are expensive. Other companies mentioned offer their software upgrades at no cost for the life of the system.

From a practical look into the VT-RNS-PT and a similar YESTech system, the programming time/ software/ process is much faster and cleaner with the YESTech. An assembly could take 15 to 30 min (Component dependent) to program on the YESTech with the same PCB taking 1 to 3 hours on the VT-RNS-PT. Should you wish to check Value or part orientation, the VT-RNS-PT would require additional programming where this is standard on the YESTech. From a false call observation, initially, both systems will have plenty. The YESTech model is, again, much easier to work through than the VT-RNS-PT.

Finally, YESTech manufacturers their systems in the US and Omron in Japan. Depending on where you are in the world, this may or may not be important for you. Omron in the US must purchase and then mark up each system based on where it is sold, so a system sold in the US would be more than a system sold in Mexico.
If you have any technical questions or if I can help you with more information, please feel free to let me know.

Lastly, I can say that i have had a great deal of experience with both organizations and I do not feel poorly about my time at YESTech. That said, I no longer have an affiliation with either company.

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#66198

new OMRON VT-RNS-pt PCB Inspection | 21 April, 2012

Hello sergio,
Probably it is too late to answer to your question, but I can not withstand to say some good words about Omron AOI. I'm located in Europe, 6 years ago our company wanted to make some Japanese manufacturers like Mazda & Toyota our clients, and had to introduce new family AOI machines (we were using VI3000 till then). We were advised by them about Omron. Since then I'm all day long engaged in AOI engineering with the whole range of their products - VT-WIN2, VT-RNS, VR-RNS_ptH. It is true that it needs some time to learn and feel the machine, but after this stage is passed it is not so difficult to create a program. Just one example - if you have one pcb with 6 modules, 200 components per module, more than 15 JEDECs, you can generate a program for 2 hours. Omron software is very flexible on duplicating one block (module) and the task is to create just the first. You can create in advance or use ready smt placement file transferred by Multiform software to save time. One thing is if you have large library and use similar components (R0805, TSSOP, SMA diode, etc.), you can paste them and after finishing with all components you'll need just to debug the specific color settings (Omron is 3 color AOI system).So according to me it is not the creation time so critical, I can create programs for 30 minutes and if components are similar with other products we can start production right away. The biggest problem for all full color AOI systems is that there is no standards for the color parameters of electronic components - body of one capacitor can be blue, yellow, brown, red, black, color of polarity stripe for MELF diode can vary in wide range, so if we want to have low level of false calls we need regularly to update programs along with manufacturer has changed something in the process of production. It is more time consuming, but it is an issue for all AOI systems (even black&white or using monochrome color settings for inspection of solder joint or polarity for example).I can assure you that by using Omron AOI systems we've managed all these years to stay stable in the market (we are 99% automotive), we are working according to the 6 sigma levels (4 ppm defect rate) and clients like Valeo are satisfied. Of course each brand has pros and cons, but Omron is at the top level by technology and possibilities, maybe it is not as simple as some other brands and somebody decides that it is too complicated or is not worth the trouble. Another issue is the level of support and training - I'm in Europe, you are in America, but you should decide it by yourself. I can advice you one thing more – 6 years ago we had the similar problem, which brand to choose, so that’s our approach. Before we decided what machine to buy we asked 3 different representatives to make a short demonstration for us with our pcbs with defects in real time. We were able to see the whole process of program generation, some general defects settings and the level of detection and debug. After program creation and debug we run second pcb with similar defects and rated the real detection rate and FRR (false rejection rate).I will not mention the other 2 brands, but they were close to Yestech. We had best results obtained by Omron. Last thing to mention is that Omron has patented its 3 color highlight technology principle, on which is based the best method for solder joint (meniscus) detection. Other manufacturers use it partially by using just one color, but it is not the same thing. 90% of all pcb manufacturing problems are concerned with the quality of the solder joint. So here Omron is the best, nobody can deny it. But as I've already said, it is a complex matter based on price, friendly environment, easy to program and maintain, etc. That is just another opinion.

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#66199

new OMRON VT-RNS-pt PCB Inspection | 21 April, 2012

Just found from another discussion :

“The Yestech (pattern match) is very easy to program and use but it took sooooo much up-keep to keep the false calls to a manageable amount. The CyberOptics (also Omron) is more of an algorithm based type of machine and it takes a long time to program from scratch when comparing to the YesTech, but I've found that up-keep is waaaaay less with this type of machine and false calls are very minimal and much easier to keep down. So higher level of false calls means higher level of operator escapes ?defective board at customer site.”

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#66202

new OMRON VT-RNS-pt PCB Inspection | 23 April, 2012

thank you so much for all reply!!!

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